CCSAGE – The future of South Marysburgh?
Administrator | Oct 06, 2011 | Comments 68
The majority of South Marysburgh residents may be exposed to wind turbine-related health risks if two proposed wind projects are approved. Most homes in South Marysburgh ward and some in Athol ward will be situated within a 2-kmTurbine Risk Zone, with 20-40% of their residents expected to experience adverse health effects.
CCSAGE has released a map of South Marysburgh / Athol showing the cumulative 2-km Turbine Risk Zone (TRZ) resulting from two proposed wind projects: WPD Canada / White Pines (30 turbines) and Gilead Power / Ostrander Point (9 turbines).
The TRZ covers 95% of the area of South Marysburgh south of Walmsley Road / County Road 10 / County Road 17, excluding the northeast area beyond Jackson’s Falls and Collier’s Roads, and excluding Long Point east of Gravelly Bay Road. It also extends into Athol ward 1.5 km west of Lighthall Road.
County resident Robert McMurtry, MD, a qualified expert witness on the effects of wind turbines on human health, stated: “It is probable that 20-40% of people within 2.0 km radii will have serious health issues including stress, psychological distress, difficulty initiating sleep and sleep disruption. These effects are risk factors for chronic disease including cardiovascular disorders and cancer.”
Dr. McMurtry continued: “The estimates are based on the work of Eja Pedersen et al, Michael Nissenbaum et al as well as Daniel Shepherd et al. They have done their research on subjects in Europe (Sweden and Holland), Maine, USA and New Zealand respectively. The published Ontario experience is similar.”
Both wind projects are currently at the proposal stage. While each has been awarded a 20-year power purchase agreement by Ontario Power Authority, neither has yet received a Renewable Energy Approval under the Green Energy Act.
The County Coalition for Safe and Appropriate Green Energy is comprised of citizens’ groups and business owners in Prince Edward County concerned about the adverse health, environmental and/or economic effects of wind turbines if inappropriately situated.
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They are facts.
Reminding people of the reckless actions of the past that have inflicted horrendous health issues needs to be put on the table. The government is in too deep dollar wise in order for us to trust them to take due diligence in ensuring the health issues have been properly and professionaly studied. I for one would not want any child growing uo by these towering industrial turbines. The risk is just too great.
I think this debate is becoming spurious and full of hyperbole. Babies born with mutations, indeed. Facts only, please.
The alternative then is to give up our energy-saturated lifestyles. Some part of nature and some humans will be affected by any kind of energy production. If everyone everywhere says ‘Not here!’ then we’ll all have to live off-grid, small, and very locally.
When I look back to the horrific health issues people dealt with in the past , toxic waste contamination , rivers and streams being poisoned. Historically Government sides with Industry , Industry does it’s own studies , denies any problem. People continue to get sick.
History just keeps repeating itself.
2 or 5 years from now , when there are so many people being affected it is impossible to refute , and it all comes crashing down.
Point is , the people along the way didn’t have to fall by the way side. Just as babies didn’t have to be born with mutations or cancers or have their parents die of some obscure bone cancer. If only people cared enough to listen.
Exactly, John! Unfortunately the truth is being lost because the media is being flooded with inaccurate information and messages of fear. The more the public hears that there are health effects, although anecdotal and unscientific, the more they’ll develop a negative attitude towards wind farms. It’s all part of the carefully orchestrated plan.
The other side of the coin in my view is that other forms of generation have both direct and indirect impacts on health which are a bigger issue than anything possibley causesd by wind generation. I have seen the so called “peer review” touted by the wind farm opposition not passing as independently and scientifically peer reviewed. Legitimate peer review hasn’t been obtainable as the “studies” did not follow the scientific method. A read to the last ERT decision painted that picture quite clearly to me.
In an October 12 interview on Global Television, Robert Hornung, President of the Canadian Wind Energy Association (CanWEA,) stated that “wind turbine sound…can have potentially indirect health impacts”. See the WCO article at http://windconcernsontario.wordpress.com/2011/10/14/canadian-wind-energy-association-changes-its-message-on-health/.
This is a point that Dr. McMurtry has been emphasizing and which Ontario’s Chief Medical Officer of Health was careful to avoid when she reference only direct effects.
Most health effects are indirect, not direct. For example, wind turbines disrupt sleep in some (not all) people living nearby. Sleep deprivation is linked to cardiovascular disease and cancer.
It is significant that CanWEA is changing its position at this time. We’re heading into 2 to 4 years of minority government before the next election. The McGuinty government is no longer able to unilaterally impose its will on rural Ontario. The peer-reviewed evidence of adverse health effects is building worldwide and no longer can be dismissed out of hand.
The pro-wind lobby realizes that, if they continue to deny health impacts, they could end up with nothing. So they are “softening” their position.
This is very good news for the pro-rural group and a wakeup call for pro-wind people.
I just wanted to note that Dr. McMurtry points out only that stress/psychological stress could be a problem for those located near the windmills, in the future. We all experience stress every day— and it is entirely within our ability to minimize our personal stress. I did not see any reference to this stress being physically caused by the windmills. A lot of stress is irrational, as well. Perhaps this is something to be considered.
No , I don’t think any of you are stupid.
But been at this a long time.
If someone wants an accurate picture . Follow the money.
It heads of out this province and this country.
If you have some time, do some research on a energy producer.
Pay particular interest to relationships.
” global sustainability in this world ?
Overpopulation
Deforestation
Consumerism
Crops for biofuels should be reconsidered.
You see any of this happening?
The global population is projected to double in the next 25 years.
Privatizing our power production for 14 million people will lead to future sustainability for the world ?
Gary, I always try to make it clear that my opinion is just that and I don’t intend to dump on others. Sorry if I wasn’t clear about that a few days ago. I was very tired after farming about 40 hours on the “holiday weekend” but that is what was needed to get the beans off and the wheat planted before the rain. Nevertheless, I did have mental time to be thankfull for the great weather, the yields above Provincial average and the top quality farmland which in spite of the Council of the 70’s, was not ruined by strip devleopment. Fortuatley, the Province exercised it’s planning authourity and put an end to the proposed destruction. Local councils everywhere are known to be more responsive to the immediate concerns of local vested interests than the larger needs for a sustainable future. Ultimate planning authority rests with the Province which should not be a surprise given local track records and the fact that Municipalities do not exist under the Constitution.
You have asked me to make my points about the science of wind energy but I won’t be taking the time to do that. For those who wish to consider where the credible science resides, I suggest a full reading of the report by our Chief Medical Officer of Health as well as the report from the last Environmental Review Tribunal. My degree is in Science and I did find those repots to be informative.
My opinion is in line with most environmental groups in believing that well situated wind/solar projects are needed to reduce current negative effects on our climate, environment, health and future prospects. I think it’s best to let the approval process to take care of the siting and environmental issues. I am not dumping on those with views which I believe to be out of line with scientific and anecdotal information.
Everyone is just a blade of grass, whether we live in a small country or large one. It’s only when every blade of grass pulls through that we get a crop of hay. Everyone needs to do their part for sustainable progress.
Ernest just tried to compare the economy of one province to global giants like China (not an “emerging” economy by any means, more like a world leader), India (ditto), and an entire continent in Africa.
Do you think we’re stupid?
Debate is good finding the true facts either for or against is the key to me as well as many others making an informed decision either for or against”IWT”.Actual building of the “IWT” hasn’t started yet and is still in the proposal stage.Thank goodness for folks like Ernest and John on both sides of the issue for standing up and laying out their points of view so people tae a closer look..
Mark, you’re right, there is a lot of wind in Toronto – much of it coming from you know who. Prior to the election he cancelled two gas powered plants saying there is “ample power” available in Ontario. This begs the question why IWTs are being erected at all. He also cancelled IWTs off shore in Scarborough when people complained they would ruin the view.
Of course, IWTs require some fossil-based back up because the power they produce is intermittent. Instead of a Green Energy “plan” we get three cynical, self-serving actions, that saved three Liberal seats. Putting alternative energy production, or any kind of production, close to the largest consumer in Ontario – the GTA – makes all sorts of sense, but that’s apparently too sensible to be part of the current “plan”.
All this aside, it is vitally important that IWTs not be located anywhere near an Important Birding Area nor in a location supporting endangered species and that’s why the Gillead and White Pines projects need to be stopped. That’s not “anti” anything but simply recognition that helping one aspect of the environment by destroying another is unacceptable and irresponsible.
I believe that expressing concerns and requesting sound, factual information for the health risks of county residents, environmental and wildlife impacts is a very positive approach and worthy action. If these concerns were addressed that would be positive. But that is not the route being taken. It is ram it through at all costs with no respect to real local concerns. There is just too much $$$$$$$ riding on this. Why is the Toronto waterfront area not being developed for the towering industrial turbines? We know there is plenty of wind there!
Ernest, why shouldn’t we be a responsible ‘blade of grass in a field’? Why shouldn’t we, in the first world countries, admit that we were wrong and greedy, and work to totally change our eco-footprints so we can be a better model for emerging countries?
Mark, I asked about the positive lifestyle actions of those fighting renewable energy in the County. Being pro-anything with no personal action means nothing! All the time, work, and money spend fighting the Green Energy Act could have been put to better use making Prince Edward County a leader in sustainability.
The war on terror on fossil fuels here is so emerging nations can build their economies over there and also using your hard earned dollars to provide the means instead of providing the services this money should be used for here.
I live in Canada, with a total population of 34 Million people. And the PR word of the day sustainability is used here ? When I look overseas and see emerging economies like China at 1.3 Billion , India at 1.5 Billion , Africa at 1 Billion and then I look at Ontario sitting at 14 Million all total ….
We are a blade of grass in a field.
The “anti wind” phrase is often being deliberately used in an attempt to negatively describe a differing viewpoint. Persons supporting the natural environment, challenging human health issues and migratory bird routes are not anti anything. They are proactive in requesting that decisions are based upon well founded scientific information, that local citizens have a voice in what is constructed in our community and that a sensitive environmental area be protected from industrial development. That is pro health, pro community and pro environment.
Thanks Donna for support !!!!!
Thanks Donna!!!!!
Tom, I’m so sorry that you are leaving this ‘debate’, and that your voice of reason and experience is being shut down. After all, you live near a turbine and have daily, real life experience! Did any of the anti-winds here ask you to share that personal experience?
Gary, you say that ‘nobody is anti-renewable energy’. Well then, what renewable energy should Prince Edward County have, and where should it be located? We can’t simply ‘take’ energy from away and not produce any ourselves! Do you want other people ‘somewhere else’ to have to live with the sights and sounds of energy production to supply your needs?! Such entitlement!
I’ve asked this before: what renewable energy projects do you and the other anti-winds have? Are you part of the solution or do you all simply take? Why don’t you prove that you are pro-renewable energy?
The land at Ostrander Point is our land. The government as the crown holds it in trust as crown land. They are the guardians of this land and in turn answerable to the citizens who are the real owners.
SAB..Yes you do have recourse with a neighbour like that it is called the property standards act, most places have them and you call a bylaw officer.
There are bylaws in place to protect your investment and quality of life..in fact you can bring a civil suit against them if their property devalues yours in a house sale. And the municpality as well if they fail to enforce the bylaw for some reason.
The point is , you all must realize there has to be a better way than this.
And you can’t tell me you like doing this back and forth anymore than I do.
These people spend far more on legal than it would cost to do a fair deal with communities.
It makes absolutely no sense how this is being done.
As a well known and respected member of our community once stated.
There should be no windmills in PEC
There are places that these IWT’s can be put but at the present time we do not need the power and all of this is a waste of money.
Look at the map at the beginning of this article and see what the proposed !WT’ will do to South Marysburgh for starters.
Unfortunately there are no guarantees in life
I understand what Ernest is saying, but we do not have control of land that is not ours. What is a neighbout moves in next door and they let their homes go…Do we have a right to ask them to buy ours at fair market value, or for the community to purchase our home?
Even to suggest that anyone’s neighbours should NOT have the right to take part in the planning of anything that affects them is simply not right. The impact developments have on people , should be of concern to any decent neighbour. It is simple common friendship and thoughtfulness.
It is not the direction , rather the way it is being done which is not right in anyway shape or form.
I find it hard to believe that anyone on here would be willing to walk all other their neighbours or let others do it and not stand with them.
When the way something is done hurts people , it is simply wrong.
Look at us.
You think we shouldn’t have better things to do with our time and energy than battle with people?
It’s not about alternate energy ..it’s about your neigbour being forced to live with something they wouldn’t have dreamed of living with.
This issue could have been easily worked out , a community plan put in place , homes affected should have a buy out option , done deal. Yes of course one or two will never be happy , but some measure of fairness to all would be in force.
Instead we have communities split apart , neighbours that were once friends , no longer are. People of all ages dealing with stress they shouldn’t have to deal with at all.
There is not one person on here that wouldn’t want some fairness in a deal.
I will never understand how people can’t see the impact of all this is having.
We should all be working together to make it as fair a deal as we can for our neighbours.
I just don’t understand why it has to be ” here they are , didn’t see this for your retirement home ? , tough luck”.
Is it so wrong to want some measure of fairness so it works for everyone?
Mark…
1) No, I’m suggesting that Ernest thinks that.
Pro-wind people use the term anti-wind. While I think that “pro-wind” is accurate, “anti-wind” is not accurate. Nobody is anti-renewable energy.
Instead, those having concerns about large-scale uncontrolled wind energy development can reasonably be labelled “pro-health” or “pro-birds” or “pro-property values” or “pro-local economy”.
More generally, this group can be labelled “pro-County”. They are interested in protecting our neighbours, our natural environment and/or our local economy.
I consider myself “pro-fairness”. I think that it is patently unfair to require a small minority of homeowners to suffer advserse health effects and/or loss of property value, even if the intended purpose is to save the world. It’s fine to require everyone to make a sacrifice, but not to require the sacrifice only from a few.
I find it disappointing that County folks are prepared to welcome wind developers to use the resources of the County at virtually no cost to them, but at the expense of their neighbours.
Ernest, I know many of the folks who post on this site, and I’m certain that they are not paid.
John, you persist in suggesting that those who disagree with you do not have good science on their side. As a trained scientist, I wouldn’t presume to suggest that you’re not a good farmer. So, make your points, but don’t dump on others who have opposing views.
I’m not paid. I’m leaving this debate. Seems as though free expression is NOT and option with a few people. Thanks to some for defending my right to express what I feel. I hope that the County moves foward on this issue.
1. Mark R. Are you suggesting that anti industrial wind turbine commenters are paid by Gilead? LOL
2. John, and the pro industrial wind turbine supporters have solid scientific evidence that they will not cause any human harm? Leaving aside the environmental impacts for the time being.
I think that the only whistle blowers who should be thanked are those who have credible science on their side. This is clearly not the case with anti wind.
Yep, there it is again…
If you’re on here and pro-wind, you MUST be a paid troll! If somebody disagrees with me, by god, they must be paid by Gilead. There is no way, shape or form that someone could disagree with me by their own accord!
And sorry Ernest, but you calling anyone else on here a troll is very ironic.
Ernest….I am not a “paid” troll as you suggest!
That…was a nasty remark.
This is about free thought and expression. You are free to express yours and I’m free to express mine.
Let’s not resort to name calling. Seems as though anyone who disagrees with your position is not welcome to comment.
I am simply expressing my observations!!!
Comments are welcome.
Don’t waste your time Gary..these are likley paid industry people paid to Troll.
PEC spoke loud and clear…as did the majority of rural Ontario shy of some pockets up north.
To these PR people it’s a game and a job.
For those of you who don’t know “Dr. Bob”, here are some of his career/medical accomplishments:
* Was Dean of the School of Medicine at the University of Western Ontario;
* Was the founding Assistant Deputy Minister of the Population and Public Health Branch at Health Canada;
* Served as a Special Advisor to the Romanow Commission on the Future of Health Care in Canada:
* In 2011, was awarded the Order of Canada “for his contributions to health care delivery in Canada”;
* Has testified to having done 4,000 hours of research on the subject of wind turbines and health;
* Founded the worldwide Society for Wind Vigilance (www.windvigilance.com);
* Has been accepted as an expert witness on wind turbines and health in two Ontario court cases (the Ian Hanna judicial review and the Kent Breeze Environmental Review Tribunal); and
* More at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_McMurtry.
Oh, by the way I really enjoy being able to express freely my position in this public forum.. Thanks County Live!!!!!
Here we go again! The great anti-turbine debate gets new energy. I guess there is no real green energy unless it happens somewhere else. I live less than a Km from a turbine and I have experienced nothing. Absolutley nothing. I guess I am just wind resistant.
A few people have suggested that those expressing concerns about wind turbines are fear mongering / using scare tactics.
What if there is something that people should be fearful of / scared about? Such as not being able to live in your home and having to sell it at a one-third loss.
Wouldn’t it be good to know about this risk in advance of the burbines being approved and built?
These concerned people are whistleblowers and should be thanked rather than criticized.
I find it disappointing that some people are more inclined to believe politicians (known to be thrifty with the truth) and developers (will say anything for money) rather than their neighbours.
She HAS to do something about them because YOU want her to?
Mark R. I was alive when the hydro lines went in and I do not remember any fuss about them–there are people that compare them with IWT’s but I am afraid they may never have seen IWT’s –all one has to do is go to wolfe island.
There was an article in todays whig standard where Leona said she may have lost because of the Green Energy thing in the county–yes and she did not do a thing to stop the IWT’s
Maybe Dalton will take a second look now that he has lost Leona who he had a lot of respect for.
FACT IS nothings been done yet….
The size of these IWTs should go offshore Andrew.
That is where these monsters belong.
Or if communities agree to host them and all are compensated that are affected.
We have an interesting political situation.
If the NDP are what they have always claimed to be and that is for the people , then everything this party stands for may very well be destroyed by not giving the planning decisions back to the communities IWTs affect.
This decision could very well wipe them off the political map and I doubt they would ever recover from it politically.
So you have a balance of power that by it’s very roots should not support full steam ahead with IWTs without a community voice.
Had this been done working with communities who indeed have every right to have a say , if it would have played out like this.
The money made selling us power is so enormous and profitable , buying out a few homes here or there would not be much of an issue financially.
You either pay lawyers or you pay the people.
Till now most have chosen to enrich the legal industry which is costing far more.
We shall see how it turns out.
It’s not so much what is being done as how it is being done.
Ernest Horvath
c/o
Coalition for Ethical Government
I wasn’t alive to know, so I’m asking this question to those who were…
Was there a gigantic uproar when telephone and hydro lines/towers went up? Was there a great deal of fear mongering going on back then too?
It is just nothing short of foolish to proceed with this industry without addressing the health issues. When you sell off the beauty of the County for the likes of this with no regard to human health,environment and migratory bird routes it is disturbing. It is an environment you cannot ever get back. There is just no going back.Once they get a handful up the rest will come in till there is no end of it.This for the almighty $$$$$$ in the guise of saving the planet for future generations. “Don’t Eat That Harold”.Follow the money path.
Andrew, I’m wondering if you live in South Marysburgh?
Given medical concerns about health, realtors’ concerns about property values and naturalists’ concerns about bird and bat migration, do you think that South Marysburgh is a good location for 39 turbines?
Wind Farm projects will not be good until more research has been done into health effects and they also find a way to store the wind power. åt Present we make wind power and pay the US to take it from us because we do not have an effective way to store it.
Looking at the map that CCSAGE has produced it really gives one the jitters.
Do you want to live in the area that the circles encompass?
can you please point to any wind farm projects which are good according to you?